possible scientific explaination for out of body experiences

[forgottenDuo]

Sorry for climbing up on my soapbox there. Part of my job is taking care of dying people, so I tend to take certain things very personally. I'll try to be a little more coherant this time. I personally believe that the Deities around us do have a say in when we die, but when we do stupid things we tend speed thing up. Like standing on the railroad tracks, we put ourselves into that situation, no one else. Common sense says we will die in that situation, or wish we had. Sorry for the rant.

But back to OOB experiences. I believe eventually science will discover what part of the brain is used during these episodes, It's only a matter of time. Understanding their findings ... as they say in the Conan movies ... "That is another story".

Jen

[Exilus]

No worries Jen we all get up on the soap box once in a while, I am a paramedic in the US, I have stopped since I moved back to germany, but I know the feeling of taking care of sick people. You are right our actions can speed things up a bit, But i am a true beleive in the fates, so for me I beleive that we are all set on a path, and there are people who smoke and never have a problem or do not die early, since I can guess from your post your in the medicle field, you know this to be true as well.

Which is why I beleive that everything happens for a reason, all our pains all our strifes are there for a reason, only the gods will know. There is a reason somewhere that the one person smokles 2 packs a day and doesn't get sick while another dies in a second. and that people who never do anything unhealthy die young(with out outside influences) and others don't.

My point was simply to say that there is a reason, but maybe we arent meant to know, just as in the story when jupiter forbid fire to begiven to man. Quote: With this they will build, things that fly, they will conquear the earth, and forget about us. There are somethings no man should understand, because all we do we do for a reason.

So that would in my eyes include not making one smoker get sick or die and another they do, one healthy living person die young naturally, while another doesn't.

Hopefully that cleared up my point.



SMOLLY: Absolutly nothing it became a spin off thing, about why I don't beleive the medicle part of the shock treatments, I have said spiritually, so i will answer you with a more sceintific answer like I did above to make it easier for you ...chuckles..

Your body uses electric to work.

If I shock you I disrupt that electric, therfore you halucinate, to me this doesn't explain OBE's because. The same thing happens when you take magic mushrooms and poision your blood, disrupting the flow of blood to your brain.

When your heart stops your blood flow is disrupted the same way just on a larger scale. Does this mean the Halucinations are from mushrroms can explain anything other than the fact you are incredibly high as a kite.

NO it doesn't, so how the hell can electric to electric be any less than a short term high of electric disruption.

[thatguy]

Since we're being scientific, most hallucinogens work by either encouraging or inhibiting the activation of specific receptor sites for one or more neurotransmitters. Although, by complex chemical action this can cause the metabolism of various parts of the brain to increase or decrease, it does not generally cause the brain to be deprived of blood, if this were the case, you would usually pass out. Although there are certain inhalants which *will* deprive the brain of blood, these strictly are not hallucinogens.

My personal feelings on how one's personal subjective experience can be significantly altered by altering the brain is that the experience of being alive and having a body inhabited by a spirit is a metaphor for what is truly going on when one exists. It's a consistent metaphor, and yields a consistent set of rules for how one expects one's environment to behave, but I also believe that this metaphor undergoes transitions, even in mundane life.

For example, when one is dreaming, one's 'role' and one's 'world' can seem natural as if this is truly what existence is. When one wakes up a transition occurs and the dream becomes "the effects of my body's brain when I'm in REM sleep". In this case I'm saying that the dream is only a side effect of a physical process when one is awake and reflecting on the dream. When one is actually dreaming, the dream is reality, not just 'seems to be reality'.

I don't believe that the source of subjective experience is rooted in any particular reality and although it [one's subjective experience] can be seemingly altered in ways consistent with one's current view of reality, this cause and effect relationship can dissolve into illusion when one undergoes a transition to a new subjective reality.

Anyways, this is just my current ambiguous viewpoint, take it for what it's worth.

cheers,

T. Guy.

[Grim Wraith]

All scientists are trying to prove is that there is no such thing as ghosts, wraiths, spirits, god, goddess, or post human protoplasmic soul. I have religios beliefs similar to thos of the ancient egyptians, if you leave out all the thins about godss/ goddesses/ sacrifices/ and mumification. There is one certain part of the belief in death that I have manipulated to prove unexplainable things and to be unique, and start my own religious beliefs. I actually have followers too. But this is off subject. They are frying the patients brain causing them to hallucinate. But when a persons brain is not being tampered with like this or by drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, or presciption/OTC drugs. That the experiences are amazing, and in some cases explain the way that particular person is going to die. Or it's just a vision, either way, these experiences are mind blowing and awesome to experience.